Living cells communicate (Introduction)

by David Turell , Monday, October 08, 2012, 18:02 (4431 days ago) @ dhw


> If you believe in eternal energy, and you believe in the Big Bang, and you believe that the Big Bang banged "from whatever energy was available at the time", how can you argue that there was no 'before'? This is simply playing word games. "Time for us began at the Big Bang" is just another way of saying that OUR universe and OUR concept of time began at the Big Bang. But that does not mean that our concept of 'before' is wrong.-What it means is that there is a discontinuity. We cannot study 'before' because it doesn't exist in our time frame since the Big Bang. We really agree. But remember, we don't know why it banged. Did it have to bang, or was it caused to bang? Was it guided to have 20 major and 100 minor parameters to allow life? Was there only one way for the bang to proceed? The multiverse scientists say it went in 10^500 directions! A totally non-provable theory. -> Nor our concept of sequent cause and effect (before and after) ... inescapable if you think that intelligent energy (your first cause) created our universe. What makes you think anyway that Guth and Vilenkin are right and Hawking is wrong? Is it perhaps because you dislike the idea of eternal and infinite combinations, as that increases the odds in favour of chance? I see no way round this if you argue that "energy has always existed eternally". Eternal energy means infinite potential, past as well as future. -"Eternal energy means infinite potential" your phrase cannot be taken seriously. Raw energy such as lightning has great potential and will strike something but is not organized in a way to do anything else. When I discuss organized energy I'm thinking of intelligence, so the raw eternal energy you propose must become organized in some way to then created potentials of complexity. I don't see how a raw blob of energy could conjure up intelligence. So I'm back to 'first cause'. There has to have been an eternal universal intelligence to start with. To go from raw energy to human consciousness is a stochastic impossibility, despite Matt's objections to having to know everything before one can make that statement.-It takes alot of faith to tolerate the picket fence. The faith that both sides can be correct.