How our brains create time (Humans)

by dhw, Thursday, July 11, 2019, 10:09 (1961 days ago) @ Balance_Maintained

dhw (as above): So you really do believe that there is no such objective reality as before and after, cause and effect? Try standing in front of a moving bus.

TONY: So, again, you miss the point. I never said that it was OUR consciousness holding things together. Some consciousness that must have been available to observe prior to the big bang.

dhw: You started this thread with the title “How our brains create time”. My point is that our brains do not create time, but it has a reality of its own. You may believe that the universe required a consciousness to “hold things together”, but that is a completely different subject. However, it might help to clarify your views if you would give us your own definition of time, assuming it is NOT the sequence of before/after and cause/effect.

TONY: That was the name of the article. However, if consciousness at our scale produces the perception of time at our scale, but time also exists at a higher scale, then it stands to reason that a higher consciousness is required for that.

What is “a higher scale” if time is a sequence of before and after, cause and effect? Your argument is tantamount to saying that if there is a reality we humans cannot observe, then it needs a different sort of consciousness to observe it. Nothing to do with the creation of reality anyway (“How our brains create time”). But once again, your thoughts would perhaps be easier to understand if you gave us your own definition of time and also of a “higher scale” of time.

DAVID: Our brain names the sequence as time. That is still a concept. Of course the sequence is real. The real question still is: is 'time' in space-time real or use of a concept entering it as a fourth dimension?

dhw: Sorry, but that is not the “real” question for me. I object to the statement that the brain creates time. You agree that the sequence is real and therefore exists independently of the brain, just like every other reality that we name, describe and try to explain, so I don’t know why you are trying to muddy the waters with space-time and the fourth dimension. Do you agree or not that the brain does NOT create time?

DAVID: I've agreed and so I'll repeat: "Our brain names the sequence as time. That is still a concept. Of course the sequence is real."

Thank you. It’s nice that we can agree for a change!