Revisiting convergence (Introduction)

by David Turell , Sunday, June 21, 2015, 14:48 (3442 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: At what level of evolutionary development do you think minds appear?
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> dhw: It depends on your definition of “mind”, which we normally associate with human thought, self-awareness, intellect etc. When experts talk of the intelligent cell, they emphatically do not mean a human form of intelligence, but if, as they tell us, bacteria are individual, cognitive, decision-making beings, I would suggest that a primitive form of mind in the sense of intelligence was present in the very first cells.-Because they were very complex from the beginning. See below.-> dhw: The next essential evolutionary step was when cells combined, and so rudimentary minds or intelligences began the process of complexification...... inventive intelligence has been at work since the beginning of evolution, and that would be a form of “mind”. It should go without saying - but I will say it all the same - that my answer is neither theistic nor atheistic, since the origin of such “minds” remains an open question.-It remains an open question for you. You need to note the point made by Paul Falkowski in his book:-http://www.amazon.com/Lifes-Engines-Microbes-Habitable-Essentials/dp/0691155372/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1434895597&sr=1-1&keywords=falkowski+life%27s+engines&pebp=1434895604582&perid=1JDKHYK7GEZW9NWSH2PE-"Paul Falkowski looks "under the hood" of microbes to find the engines of life, the actual working parts that do the biochemical heavy lifting for every living organism on Earth. With insight and humor, he explains how these miniature engines are built--and how they have been appropriated by and assembled like Lego sets within every creature that walks, swims, or flies. Falkowski shows how evolution works to maintain this core machinery of life, and how we and other animals are veritable conglomerations of microbes."-And:-"Today, driven by ongoing technological innovations, the exploration of the “nanoverse,” as the realm of the minuscule is often termed, continues to gather pace. One of the field's greatest pioneers is Paul Falkowski, a biological oceanographer who has spent much of his scientific career working at the intersection of physics, chemistry, and biology. His book Life's Engines: How Microbes Made Earth Habitable focuses on one of the most astonishing discoveries of the twentieth century-that our cells are comprised of a series of highly sophisticated “little engines” or nanomachines that carry out life's vital functions. It is a work full of surprises, arguing for example that all of life's most important innovations were in existence by around 3.5 billion years ago-less than a billion years after Earth formed, and a period at which our planet was largely hostile to living things. How such mind-bending complexity could have evolved at such an early stage, and in such a hostile environment, has forced a fundamental reconsideration of the origins of life itself."-http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2015/jul/09/how-you-consist-trillions-tiny-machines/-This book makes the point I make. Our cells autonomously run the machines of our body automatically. Please explain how complexity appeared 3.5 billion years ago to give bacteria the appearance of 'minds'. It requires a planning mind if you believe in cause and effect.