A Brief Message (Humans)

by xeno6696 @, Sonoran Desert, Monday, February 20, 2012, 17:34 (4411 days ago)

dhw, david,-I'm extremely busy, and especially to dhw: I read your initial response to me from about a week ago and your follow up where you mediated your dialog a bit.-My current problem is that at this moment I'm more or less completely reforming how I think about many of these topics, so it isn't fair just yet for me to respond as it could be obsolete thinking by the time you read it. -Giobran's book at present hasn't attacked me with anything other than what I would consider to be ordinary stuff, but he keeps hinting at powerful ideas.-I will say this: not his words, but he pointed out something that made me think.-We know that there was an initial condition, and we already know what the end state will be. (Alpha and Omega.) But the key, jaw-dropping stunner for me is the realization that the universe at the beginning was at no higher state of order than it will be until its demise. In other words... arguments about complexity in terms of life, in terms of the necessity of the creator... fail as they are illusory. In what way? If there was no higher state of order than the singularity: All forms of order that we see and can discern are necessarily *lower* forms of order. And it is the 2nd law of thermodynamics that drives this forward. Oddly... this corellates considerably well with the writings of mystics I've read across many traditions. Tony once meandered down that path: The exploration that we were once mighty and have been decaying...-(The end I discussed above is the stretching of space to be perfectly flat.) -Musings of a madman I'm sure, but as I said my mind is ablaze of late...

--
\"Why is it, Master, that ascetics fight with ascetics?\"

\"It is, brahmin, because of attachment to views, adherence to views, fixation on views, addiction to views, obsession with views, holding firmly to views that ascetics fight with ascetics.\"

A Brief Message

by dhw, Monday, February 20, 2012, 20:48 (4410 days ago) @ xeno6696

Matt: I'm extremely busy, and especially to dhw: I read your initial response to me from about a week ago and your follow up where your mediated your dialog a bit. My current problem is that at this moment I'm more or less completely reforming how I think about many of these topics...-First of all, many thanks for the message. I was beginning to worry that I'd offended you, which is the last thing I would ever want to do.-The rest of your post rings some alarm bells. Especially when you finish: "Musings of a madman I'm sure, but as I said my mind is ablaze of late..." The deeper you go into the mysteries, the more unsettling they become, and they can be dangerous. You know that you are never going to get to an absolute truth, and there are so many contradictions even within the fabric of what we think we know that we can easily finish up being sure of absolutely nothing. And yes indeed, that way madness lies. Those who have faith in God or chance have already entered their own comfort zone. Those of us who have no such faith HAVE to settle on a level with which we're comfortable, and for me that is the commonsense level of intersubjective realities and acknowledgement that the rest of reality is out of reach (barring the unforeseen). I remain fascinated by "the rest of reality", which is why I love discussing it with people like yourself, David, BBella, Tony, Romansh, George and the many others who have contributed over the years. But I can live with not knowing. The fire in me is gentle, whereas my fear is that your blazing mind could do you harm. But perhaps I'm overreacting.

A Brief Message

by xeno6696 @, Sonoran Desert, Wednesday, February 29, 2012, 21:18 (4401 days ago) @ dhw

Matt: I'm extremely busy, and especially to dhw: I read your initial response to me from about a week ago and your follow up where your mediated your dialog a bit. My current problem is that at this moment I'm more or less completely reforming how I think about many of these topics...
> 
> First of all, many thanks for the message. I was beginning to worry that I'd offended you, which is the last thing I would ever want to do.
> 
> The rest of your post rings some alarm bells. Especially when you finish: "Musings of a madman I'm sure, but as I said my mind is ablaze of late..." The deeper you go into the mysteries, the more unsettling they become, and they can be dangerous. You know that you are never going to get to an absolute truth, and there are so many contradictions even within the fabric of what we think we know that we can easily finish up being sure of absolutely nothing. And yes indeed, that way madness lies. Those who have faith in God or chance have already entered their own comfort zone. Those of us who have no such faith HAVE to settle on a level with which we're comfortable, and for me that is the commonsense level of intersubjective realities and acknowledgement that the rest of reality is out of reach (barring the unforeseen). I remain fascinated by "the rest of reality", which is why I love discussing it with people like yourself, David, BBella, Tony, Romansh, George and the many others who have contributed over the years. But I can live with not knowing. The fire in me is gentle, whereas my fear is that your blazing mind could do you harm. But perhaps I'm overreacting.-Don't be alarmed. There's a huge burst that happens in my brain any time I encounter a way of thinking that I've never considered: It's an exciting world of possibilities... -Madness lies any place where a prophet treads!

--
\"Why is it, Master, that ascetics fight with ascetics?\"

\"It is, brahmin, because of attachment to views, adherence to views, fixation on views, addiction to views, obsession with views, holding firmly to views that ascetics fight with ascetics.\"

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