The God Delusion (Introduction)

by David Turell @, Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 01:24 (5694 days ago)

Antony Flew has reviewed Dawkin's book: Worth looking at. http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/antony-flew-reviews-dawkins-the-god-d...

The God Delusion

by George Jelliss ⌂ @, Crewe, Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 11:40 (5693 days ago) @ David Turell

Here is Flew being interviewed. 
He admits to not having thought about a lot of things. - Anthony Flew - The Honest Ex-Atheist - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqFXducCkdo&NR=1 - Anthony Flew on the afterlife - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NeCt1rK9MEc&NR=1 - As has been pointed out when the review was reproduced on Richard Dawkins .net, Flew appears to have read only the index and the footnote in which he is referred to (which is his only citation in the index). Most of Chapter 1 of "The God Delusion" was a detailed examination of Einstein's views. - Dawkins p.20: "My title, The God Delusion, does not refer to the God of Einstein and the other enlightened scientists of the previous section. That is why I needed to get Einsteinian religion out of the way to begin with: it has a proven capacity to confuse." - There are a lot of Einstein quotes in this video: - Was Einstein a Pantheist? - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qOsDR5sZTk - It concludes that he was an atheist.

The God Delusion

by David Turell @, Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 16:38 (5693 days ago) @ George Jelliss

Dawkins p.20: "My title, The God Delusion, does not refer to the God of Einstein and the other enlightened scientists of the previous section. That is why I needed to get Einsteinian religion out of the way to begin with: it has a proven capacity to confuse."
> 
> There are a lot of Einstein quotes in this video:
> 
> Was Einstein a Pantheist?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qOsDR5sZTk
> 
> It concludes that he was an atheist. - There are many views of Einstein. My impression is that he felt there is something behind the mysteries of the universe. More of an agnostic than an atheist: http://www.ctinquiry.org/publications/reflections_volume_1/torrance.htm

The God Delusion

by David Turell @, Saturday, October 25, 2008, 16:59 (5633 days ago) @ David Turell

It is so easy to refute Dawkins. Note this exerpt from an interview with Tom Wolfe: 
Wolfe: "There's neuroscience the science and there's genetic theory. They are two entirely different things. José Delgado, the Spanish neuroscientist, son of the Copernicus, the Galileo of neuroscience, José M.R. Delgado, puts it very clearly: "The human brain is enormously complicated. We have made only a few small steps in finding out how it works. All the rest is literature." Delgado mentions no names, but if he has noticed them at all, "all the rest" probably includes some of the best known genetic theorists, such as Richard Dawkins and Daniel Dennett, a zoologist and a philosopher. They are not neurologists. They know precious little about the human brain. They seem to have captivated a big following, especially Dawkins, but not with anything that could be called neuroscience. They're writing speculative literature. Their theory is that the human brain is nothing but a machine, after all, a form of computer, and therefore it has no free will. In any situation we find ourselves we can only do what our evolutionary software—they love computer talk like "software," meaning genetic makeup—has programmed us to do. - So at a recent conference on the implications of genetic theory for the legal system—five distinguished genetic theorists are up on stage—I stood up in the audience and asked, "If there is no free will, why should we believe anything you've said so far? You only say it because you're programmed to say it." You've never heard such stuttering and blathering in response to anything in your life."

The God Delusion

by George Jelliss ⌂ @, Crewe, Saturday, October 25, 2008, 19:38 (5633 days ago) @ David Turell

DT: "It is so easy to refute Dawkins." - You've really got it bad with Dawkins haven't you! - Wolfe: "There's neuroscience the science and there's genetic theory. They are two entirely different things." - True. No-one ever said they were the same. - José Delgado: "The human brain is enormously complicated. We have made only a few small steps in finding out how it works. All the rest is literature." - True. I'm sure Dawkins would agree. - Wolfe/DT?: Delgado mentions no names, but if he has noticed them at all, "all the rest" probably includes some of the best known genetic theorists, such as Richard Dawkins and Daniel Dennett, a zoologist and a philosopher. They are not neurologists. They know precious little about the human brain. - So Wolfe, a novelist and journalist knows more? Sam Harris is a neurologist, or at least is a PhD student of neurology. - Wolfe/DT?: Their theory is that the human brain is nothing but a machine, after all, a form of computer, and therefore it has no free will. - Total rubbish. Straw Man. - Wolfe/DT?: In any situation we find ourselves we can only do what our evolutionary software /// meaning genetic makeup /// has programmed us to do. - More Total Rubbish. - Wolfe/DT?: So at a recent conference on the implications of genetic theory for the legal system—five distinguished genetic theorists are up on stage—I stood up in the audience and asked, "If there is no free will, why should we believe anything you've said so far? You only say it because you're programmed to say it." You've never heard such stuttering and blathering in response to anything in your life." - So who were these idiots? Postmodernist professors no doubt as portrayed in Wolfe's novel reviewed here: - http://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/love-in-the-age-of-neuroscience - If these people have captured the campuses on American universities as Wolfe depicts, the state of America is indeed parlous. - Fortunately Dawkins is at Oxford and is far from being a postmodernist. - I'm not going to answer for Dawkins, but my own view is that "will" and its degrees of "freedom" make up a very complex notion, and that explanations in terms of "soul" are far too simplistic to contain.

The God Delusion

by David Turell @, Sunday, October 26, 2008, 16:59 (5632 days ago) @ George Jelliss

You've really got it bad with Dawkins haven't you! - Its not just me. So do English folks like Melanie Phillips in the Spectator: http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/2543431/is-richard-dawkins-still-evolving.thtml

The God Delusion

by George Jelliss ⌂ @, Crewe, Monday, October 27, 2008, 15:18 (5631 days ago) @ David Turell

You've really got it bad with Dawkins haven't you!
> 
> Its not just me. So do English folks like Melanie Phillips in the Spectator: http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/2543431/is-richard-dawkins-still-evolving.thtml - Needless to say in this article she has obviously misrepresented and or misunderstood Dawkins' views, as is her way. - Melanie Phillips is a controversialist whose statements on anything should be treated as unreliable, e.g. one of her Jewish journalist colleagues writes: - http://www.jonathanfreedland.com/articles/archives/000329.html - She is also strongly anti-science, being an "Intelligent Design" groupie, and an MMR and Global warming sceptic. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melanie_Phillips - I would comment more strongly but don't wish to put dhw in danger of prosecution for libel.

The God Delusion

by dhw, Monday, October 27, 2008, 10:41 (5631 days ago) @ George Jelliss

George writes: I'm not going to answer for Dawkins, but my own view is that "will" and its degrees of "freedom" make up a very complex notion, and that explanations in terms of "soul" are far too simplistic to contain. - It might be interesting to know what those explanations are meant to contain, but I doubt if anyone would disagree with your view that these things are very complex. I would also agree that explanations in terms of "soul" are too simplistic. But are they any more simplistic than the theory that globules of matter can spontaneously combine to reproduce, adapt, and ultimately become conscious of themselves?

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