Without Discoverable Beginning (The limitations of science)

by dhw, Monday, January 23, 2012, 12:09 (4686 days ago) @ xeno6696

Matt has given us some interesting information about Buddhist practices, particularly in relation to money. -Many thanks for this. When you look at the chaotic state of the western world's economy, you can't help feeling the Theravedans had a point!-MATT: [Shinzen Young] seems to implicitly claim that Zen can give you an OOB. Not buying it. But it would be interesting to know that I could forcefully step outside of my body whenever I meditated enough.-You recently alerted us to a website:-http://www.near-death.com/experiences/triggers06.html-One section on the website was about Jerry Gross, who claims precisely this ability to enter an out-of-body "astral realm" at will. As I indicated in my "Afterlife" post 14 Jan. at 08.44, I was not impressed. -As regards "source consciousness", you say you've occasionally achieved a state of mental calm which had a profound physiological effect. We all recognize that body and mind can each have enormous influence on the other, but while chemical changes to the body can clearly affect the mind, e.g. through drugs or disease ... which is a problem for dualism ... how the heck does the mind change the chemistry of the body (a problem for materialism)? David kindly drew our attention to two articles (under "Consciousness explored", 18 Jan. at 18,40) which I didn't think contained anything new, and you and I were both disappointed that Shinzen Young didn't discuss the subject. (Actually I'm relieved that you were disappointed, because I was afraid I might have missed something!) These statements of mine all illustrate the problem pretty graphically: what didn't think, what was disappointed, what was relieved, what was afraid, what might have missed something? Chemicals in my head? And what directs the chemicals in my head? Other chemicals?