Why not--Maltheism? (Religion)

by xeno6696 , Sonoran Desert, Monday, July 04, 2011, 04:16 (4680 days ago) @ Balance_Maintained

Life exists because of the 2nd law, not in spite of or in contradiction to it.
> 
> I think you misunderstand my position. I do not think that life exists in spite of, or in contradiction to, the second law of thermodynamics. I am saying that order exists in symbiosis with chaos. Chaos brings order brings chaos in a never ending cycle. And while I do not doubt for a send your mathematical skills or the proof in your equations, I would argue that your use of heat as the only form of energy being received from the sun betrays the inaccuracy rather potently. It is not just heat, light, radiation, or any other one thing vibrating down the wave spectrum that we receive and use, but the entire spectrum. And while not all, or even most, energy is absorbed directly by earth or its inhabitants, that does not negate the powerful affects that the non-absorbed energy plays in maintaining order. What keeps the planets' cores molten, and their bodies spinning? What effects to the other astronomical bodies in the solar system, other than our sun, have on planet earth? There are recent theories about EM waves being the responsible party for gravity, waves that can only be generated by stars. Without these waves pushing against the celestial bodies from various directions the planets' orbits would degrade and life would cease to exist. Don't limit the scope to what directly impacts what you can taste, touch, see, smell, and hear. Look further out and see that the requirements for life on this planet extend far beyond our own solar system and quite possibly beyond our own galaxy.
> 
> Sorry if I got a little off track there.-No... not off track. -But I don't think your main critique here has much bearing; allow me to explain, and ask you for a reformulation if you think I'm reading you incorrectly.-I assume we agree that entropy is the measure of disorder in the universe. 
I assume we agree that life is definitely order. -My initial agreement to LHP religion was on the topic that on average, order can only be created or maintained at the expense of more disorder overall. -This is a restatement of the 2nd law. -This is what is observed. -Your main critique is in asserting that I don't talk about the other energy coming from the Sun. I disagree with this critique.-Heat, (K) is a measure of energy--total output. This includes light and ALL radiation that is emanated from the sun. That's why I chose it. To get from K to calories you simply perform a couple of mathematical transformations. Those numbers include both the heat energy from the sun as well as the light received (and transformed into energy by plants). EM waves are just light--and are therefore also included in the calculation of K. -Gravity is a different kind of energy, but I think this is the only place you go off topic--the primary source of energy for life is the Sun. Our orbit is an equilibrium between the earth's mass and the sun's mass; so there isn't really a deep impact between different gravities here (unless you count asteroid strikes!).-Your suggestion that celestial bodies further out having a deep impact upon us is further mitigated by the fact that gravity again balances out according the the inverse square law... our sun and its position to other stars and the milky way are in a similar state of equilibrium to the planets around our sun. -Your final argument I'm having a hard time with. I can only see an extremely narrow band of light, and most of the other things I've discussed don't lend themselves easily to the 5 senses. (MeV is not a concept eyes, ears, nose, mouth, or skin readily appreciate... only my mind...) -And there are an estimated 10,000 suns like hours within the hypothesized "hospitable zone" around our Milky Way... so while we're all we know, there's reason to doubt we're all that's there. -Being around a special sun, around a special arm circling a special galaxy on a doomsday course with Andromeda... still doesn't defeat the fact that that ALL of that order has been created at the expense of the 2nd law's ruthless enforcement...-http://www.bartol.udel.edu/~seckel/courses/phys_811/units.pdf (For a good listing of all the conversion factors--light, mass, heat, energy... they are all the same...)

--
\"Why is it, Master, that ascetics fight with ascetics?\"

\"It is, brahmin, because of attachment to views, adherence to views, fixation on views, addiction to views, obsession with views, holding firmly to views that ascetics fight with ascetics.\"