More "miscellany" (General)

by David Turell @, Friday, December 03, 2021, 15:47 (48 days ago) @ dhw

Reality: God is a mathematician

DAVID: God set automatic processes into motion for the universe, not life's evolution.

dhw: How do you know?

I believe in what God does, has done.

Monarchs use toxic milkweed

DAVID: All caterpillars eat toxic milkweed!! Somehow a few lucky ones were not killed? You have theorized luck to avoid God's designs.

dhw: They do NOW! NOW they have the “antibodies”! Why do you ignore the point I have made above about bacteria and Covid? I am not theorizing luck. These are facts that are illustrated over and over again in our present. First comes the “invader”, then comes the response, and there are deaths and there are survivors before the defence is perfected.

Again you are proposing luck. The Monarchs have a complex lifecycle and all young must use milkweed. I still think God designed the lifecycle and used milkweed as a requirement.

dhw: I have no idea what point you are making. Mine is that humans didn’t need all the life forms and foods of the past that had no connection with them, and even in the present we can survive without large numbers of the species etc. you say your purposeful God designed to be our food. So why did he design them if we don't need them?

DAVID: It is your lack of understanding the need for all ecosystems that is showing.

dhw: All ecosystems are necessary for the life forms that exist within them. What you do not seem to understand is that there have been different ecosystems and different life forms for 3.X billion years, and the vast majority had no connection with humans and their ecosystems, which makes nonsense of your theory that all life forms and all ecosystems were “part of the goal of evolving [= designing] humans” and their food. As you yourself have said, these systems were for the past, not the present, and extinct life has no role in current life.

Why are you in the past, when all I am discussing in present necessary ecosystems.


DAVID: each group of early humans followed the same path of development of lifestyles as God's endpoint of evolution.

dhw: So why do you think he designed them, if the only ones he wanted were sapiens?

DAVID: With interbreeding each group provided new good attributes for the eventual final humans, as previously discussed.

dhw: But since according to you your God is perfectly capable of creating the species he wants without predecessors (e.g. during the Cambrian explosion), you are still left with the question why he created sapiens in such a roundabout way if sapiens was the only species he wanted. Possible theistic explanations: 1) sapiens was not the only species he wanted; 2) sapiens was the species he wanted, and he was experimenting in order to “perfect” the design; 3) as he proceeded with different designs, he had more and more new ideas; 4) your God “set automatic processes into motion for the universe”, including that of evolution. In other words, he invented a process that ran itself in a vast free-for-all. Four theistic explanations which, as you have agreed many times, logically fit the facts of history, in stark contrast to your own admission that you have no idea why God would have opted for your own theory, as bolded above.

I am agreeing that He allowed a bush of hominins, specifically because He also recognized the bacteria and viruses could make mistakes in the wrong places and a group of homo species would add advantageous attributes, as previously noted.

I shan’t be posting anything tomorrow.

Noted. Give Chris our hopes and wishes for more time.

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