More "miscellany" (General)

by David Turell @, Monday, October 25, 2021, 16:34 (33 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: The problem is you skip the obvious. God's created history tells us exactly what He did. You object to God doing it that way!!!

dhw: The problem is you skip the obvious, which is that history presents us with a vast bush of extinct life forms and foods, the majority of which had no connection with humans, although you insist that your God’s only goal was to design humans plus food. But you refuse to recognize that this theory makes no sense.

It is the red plus food that is a giant point you have to diminish to make your illogical objection. The giant bush of life is the food necessary out the of necessity to fuel life.

Cosmologic philosophy: dhw said once universe too big

DAVID: I have every right to dismiss your humanized form of God. He is yours alone.

dhw: But you find each of my theistic explanations logical, you keep agreeing that your God may have human attributes,

You constantly ignore my qualifier because you have to, as it negates your distorted use of my agreement. Your theories are illogical only if I accept your heavily humanized God.

DAVID: […] as a human you don't see the point of a giant universe doesn't mean it is wrong of God to create it.

dhw: I have not said it is wrong of your God to create it, and this was my answer:
dhw: And you cannot find a single reason why he would create an infinite number of exploding stars and a vast number of life forms in order to produce one solar system and one species (plus its food). Please stop pretending that an attack on your illogical theory is an attack on your God (if he exists).

DAVID: I accept that God creates what He creates for His own reasons, the point you fight. […] Your personal reasoning is not His, and so you object to His creation of a giant universe. He did it, accept it.

dhw: If God exists, then of course he did it, but we don’t know what his reasons would have been, whereas you tell us his reason for creating billions of extinct and extant galaxies etc. was to design humans plus our food. Yet another of your dodges: you give us your illogical theory, I attack it for its illogicality, and so you pretend that your theory is the truth and I am attacking your God not your theory!

Again a total misunderstanding of how to think about God. God does exactly what He wants for His own reasons. Since the giant universe exists with aspects we do not understand it does not mean they weren't part of creating humans. We live in a God-created reality and try to understand why He did it the way He did. We explore scientifically, not question it.

A beginning or not
Confusing Imagination with Reality
QUOTE: Sutter asserts that Bento and Zalel’s article offers a credible response against the evidence for a cosmic beginning. Yet this claim is only based on what might be possible in the realm of the imagination. The referenced paper is a highly theoretical and entirely speculative cosmological model that is almost entirely divorced from physical reality. Sutter even acknowledges this point

dhw: Of course it’s imagination. And so is the theory that a universe can spring from nothing, and so is the theory that a sourceless universal mind has occupied an eternal “before” and created the universe out of its immaterial self. Nobody can prove anything about what happened before the big bang, if the big bang happened! This discussion encourages pots to call kettles black!

DAVID: Something happened since we are here instead of nothing.

dhw: I can’t imagine anyone disagreeing with that, so let’s settle for it: something happened, and nobody knows what it was or what caused it, so by all means let’s discuss the different theories and their merits or their weaknesses, but please stop pretending you know that one theory is right and the others are wrong.

I agree logical faith is not logical proof. Pascal's leap is required.

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