Intentionally Hidden (Religion)

by BBella , Saturday, March 30, 2013, 06:13 (4045 days ago) @ Balance_Maintained

[David] We can only know God through His works. There is no direct evidence, because He wants it that way.
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> >Tony: I think it is more than a simple case of 'he want's it that way'. I see that there is a reason behind it that is very valid and grounded in sound logic. Not going to derail this thread for that though.
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> >Bella: Tony, I am interested to hear your perspective on the reason behind why God did things the way he did them. Maybe you could put it under a separate category?
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> First, understand that I am speaking partially from a biblical perspective when I am looking at this topic. Perhaps that should go without saying, but, better to be explicit. 
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> In the beginning(that just sounds epic...) God revealed himself to man in a manner that one could almost call routine. There are numerous times in the early scriptures where God's presence was revealed directly.....................
> If God were to reveal himself, it would no longer be an act of faith. People would do what they were told to do because of fear, not loyalty, love, or faith. If that happened, YHWH would have failed the challenge that he was presented with, he would be declared unfit to rule and humanity unfit to exist. 
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> That is why I say that it is no great surprise that we can not find obvious evidence of God. If you start with the faith that there is a God, and then you will see the evidence absolutely everywhere. Seeing is not believing, believing is seeing.-Tony, I appreciate your taking the time to express what you meant by God doing the things the way he did, and staying "intentionally hidden". I have had this "faith that there is a God" for all of my life. And until the last decade or a little more I had concluded much of what you say above about God, the reason he has done things the way that has been done, etc, with very little difference then what you say above. I remain open to this way of "seeing" God (not closing it off), but in the last years, I have become more open to "seeing" beyond words that are written (specifically the words of the Bible as well as other sacred books). Oddly enough, it was the words written in the Bible itself, in some ironic sense, that gave me permission to look beyond words of the scriptures to see what I "myself" might can see - without the assistance of man's words and views of God, including the men who wrote the Bible. -At the time, I wasn't looking for permission, yet I believe that as a Christian, I must have needed it, because without it, I probably would have remained within the box. We Christians, you will agree I'm sure, are in some sense, boxed in with our firm belief's, as sheep without separate minds. Or even better, like dogs; we may differ in many ways, but we are all the same in kind. -Our box is the sacred "Word of God" and, let's not forget, those who delve deeply, expounding and squeezing out it's every bit of information to it's innermost/furthermost reaches of it's parameters. We can go from this parameter to that parameter, but we go no further. Possibly, in the back of our mind we believe (or fear?) Satan dwells beyond those set parameters. Whatever the reason, like sheep, we stay within our fence. -The scripture that gave me the permission to venture beyond the fence is Romans 1:20-23. For the benefit of others, I will quote it here: NKJV -"For since the creation of the world His {Gods} invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man--and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things."-Of course this scripture was not placed there to give me permission to look beyond the Word for God (I know it was not meant to), but it did. And when I did observe what the God this scripture spoke of, low and behold, it looked nothing like the God of the scriptures, to me. This scripture said plainly to me, God is not an intentionally "hidden" God, but a God that is clearly seen by the things that are made. When I removed mans words, ideas and thoughts of God and just look at what is made, I saw very little of anything that the scriptures express that God is like. That which can clearly be seen is that which I see right now, at any given moment, in every moment. When man then tells me what God is, through words or thought, and places his ideas on What Is, I begin to suspect "beings" beyond this world, like aliens and such. When man gives attributes like a man to God, I do not relate that with what I see. -continued.....